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Discussion: Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Product
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dra_red |
Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Product
Apr 11 2008, 10:02 AM EDT
Our success as an society is measured by GDP and related indicators. Lets move this to more meaningful indicators. Who really thinks that the health of the nation is measured by how much stuff we produce? Working towards sustainable development or general social wellbeing should be the governments targets rather than superficial targets like GDP. Lets discuss what targets would be best? Cheers, Dale 1 out of 5 found this valuable. Do you? |
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Posted Anonymously |
1. RE: Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Produ
Apr 11 2008, 8:11 PM EDT
"Sustainable development" is a meaningless buzzword used by lefty-politicians to get what they want.
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dra_red |
2. RE: Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Produ
Apr 11 2008, 10:21 PM EDT
If we fish beyond the replacement level of the fish stock then we are participating in unsustainable practices. If we chop down trees faster than they can grow then that is also an unsustainable practice. The list goes on of different practices that we currently use that are unsustainable. So, in short I disagree with your comment, it is not a meaningless buzzword. However, if you don'tt hink sustainable development is a good indicator of social health, what do you think would be? Cheers, Dale Do you find this valuable? |
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Posted Anonymously |
3. RE: Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Produ
Apr 11 2008, 11:50 PM EDT
Businesses are generally pretty good at ensuring their ongoing survival. Farmers don't slaughter every cow for example - or they'd have nothing left. Problems with logging occur where loggers are logging land they don't own/haven't paid (enough) for.... Loggers get access to government controlled land for a pittance. This is a case of government-failure -- not market failure.Overfishing is a case of "tragedy of commons". The solution to tragedy of commons scenarios is almost always privatisation. Regions of ocean for purposes of fishing should be auctioned to the highest bidder. That way, the person who values it the most gets access, whilst everybody else gets a cut of that value (since the revenue of the auction goes to government). GDP per capita is a good enough measure for both wealth AND social health... problems only arise where government gets in the way and screws things up. They sometimes do this based on good intentions, and sometimes not, but the results are usually the same (ie, bad). Do you find this valuable? |
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dra_red |
4. RE: Sustainable develoopment indicator instead of Gross Domestic Produ
Apr 12 2008, 1:42 AM EDT
I don't think it is correct to generalise that all businesses are good at ensuring their survival, it is just that the we only see the good businesses stick around for long enough to notice. There is no shortage of businesses slitting their own necks. You describe over logging as a government failing but this is the whole point. If the government focuses purely on GDP then it will not place a value on the sustainable use of the forests. A focus on GDP results in an abuse of the resources available. Obviously the government does not focus purely on GDP, it looks at the sustainability of different schemes and regulates accordingly. What I am saying is that that result should be the focus of the government rather than the GDP that is commonly reported to the public. We, the public, should know how well managed our resources are. GDP is not a satisfactory measure of the health of the nation. Stopping overfishing by privatisation is just nonsense. A fish stock may be able to withstand 20 years or more of over fishing. An investor could invest heavily in purchasing the rights to fish as they wish knowing fully that their return will be made in 20 years after which they can exit from the industry. The same type of regulation as I describe for logging is required. GDP is a measure of how much we produce. A failing society with high suicide, low general life satisfaction can have a higher GDP than a different society that has a better social health. Unless we get our targets right we will always be heading in the wrong direction. Cheers, Dale Do you find this valuable? |
